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I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

Last post 04-13-2007, 9:11 PM by pattye. 16 replies.
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  •  03-26-2007, 3:26 PM 21100

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    (continued) some of you - meaning not all of you just parts.  i would like to see less pictures of ken and anthony robbins's friends and groupies and wives.  less video of turned on boomer chicks that covet our so called spiritual leaders - more of an updated website and less - in your face - can't be moved attitude.  i would like to see more of a welcoming atmospere less of confused hypersexuality - and more empasis on contemplation and prayer.   less false treachings about tantra and more of an emphasis about the  poor and the underprivilaged.  and less of the i am god philosophy.  boomers rule - unfortunatly and they are all retiring.  in case you haven't noticed but there is a lot of fucking work to do in this planet if we are going to survive.  this selfish bullshit does not help.  whether your fucking ego likes it or not...got it?

    joshua morell
    joshmorrell@yahoo.com

    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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  •  03-27-2007, 2:58 AM 21112 in reply to 21100

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Hey Zenwolf,

    If you're so unhappy with how II presents itself, why did you join us?

    I'm just sayin'...

    -MarkD


    Just enough enlightenment for this time around, please.
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  •  03-29-2007, 10:21 PM 21219 in reply to 21100

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Dear Zenwolf:   I take what you say very seriously.   However,  Why not try starting a thread even if you have to do it more than once.  And/or tell us what it is you are doing  in any of these areas.  And get to know people.  Ask questions when you get a hint or an outright statement.  Perhaps your anger is coming from a place that you can pin down more specifically.  I know because I can let loose like that.  What do you want specifically or want to know about.  Never know where it will lead.  Welcome and I hope you stay.  Pattye    PS  I am still trying to decide how much and what to do to use what I have to learn.    I was still trying to find my way around after only two weeks.
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  •  03-30-2007, 1:54 AM 21225 in reply to 21219

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    hello pattye.  I am actually very surprised your thread was so nice and forgiving.  i just posted an apology on the blog comments on the "whats new section".  i am just super jealous of these people.  all great and gracious people i bet.  but i went low...low..low..in my anger and rage towards them.  Ken Wilbur, Anthony Robbins I am so sorry i verbally attacked you and your wives.  like i said before - to quote a john lennon song - I am just a jealous guy.  it is post 911 trauma.  it's hard.  because all this talk about enlightenment and tantra and spiritual stuff makes me uncomfortable.  i'm a pretty private person and i have struggled a bit.  so when i see all of these superstars, like dan deida, or the lead singer of LIVE (great freaking band by the way) i get pissed.  because i can't compete with you/those folks.  especially when it comes to a woman.  how the hell do you compete with money, stardom and a super buddha with a hot consort?  i have lost a lot of trust.  especially when it comes to this new found "broadcast spirituality" and pardon my rancor, "in your face'" look at my teachers and there friends.  most of us don't have that at all.  I don't.  i know the majority of spiritual seeking people on the planet don't.  they live quiet lives and pray to the almighty or try to gracefully give of themselves, secretly.  like jesus taught in the gospels.  I revel my self to GOD, the creator, the "creation, each other - whatever - secretly...in a room - on a cushion...and i get NO applause, no recognition and NO refuge from other people and friends.  not to mention the fucking money.  pretty shallow, huh?  i can't compete with this...and it's not a competition.  I try to love every single one of you.  i just can't find any loyalty or a girlfriend.  is a lover so bad nowadays?  do we have to go so fast?  on one side you have a post 911 book burning party on the other you have a boomer orgy.  i'm sorry but that is how i feel sometimes.  i'm horny as shit and a hypocrite BUT i still want traditional love and oneness and peace.  I love all of you and i will endure.  please accept my apology to all of you.  take care and God Bless - Josh
    joshmorrell@yahoo.com

    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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  •  03-31-2007, 10:02 AM 21307 in reply to 21225

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Dear Zenwolf:   I like your picture.  Are you taking pics or what.  Appraiser. Others would know I am sure.  The good news is there is not a person in the world who has not felt the way you do/did?  WE are all alike and want the same things.  We really have so much in common and thinking about that deeply, must bring us closer. And someitmes one person will carry the shadow side for a whole group.  I would advise you not to take THAT so seriously.  Advise is my least favorite word and I do stand by the statement this time.

    Were you at 9/11.   I would like to know and I have a feeling someothers would also.  Where in upstate NY are you from unless you do not want to say.  I am very

    familiar with Watertown and areas around there.  It would also help if I knew why you joined Integral and where you are with that.  You do know that KW does have the distinction of adding the psychological to the spiritual and says that is the contribution of the West.  I believed that for some time since I have taught both along with PE  and am a retired Psychotherapist.   One day my daughter in law told me that she hated her husband, my son.  Later she apologized profusely and I said that it did not bother me.   We love and we hate.  Other things bothered me that we talked about and that included both of us.  We had our issues also.  I tell you that so that you can leave stuff like that behind.  AT least I hope so.  Waiting for you to respond.

    Authenticity is so refreshing.   Love Pattye

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  •  03-31-2007, 12:03 PM 21319 in reply to 21307

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    pattye - i used to be a cameraman in upstate ny and then i moved to boston.  i was in rochester, ny when 9-11 happened.  i did not cover the EVENT in new york city but i covered the local stuff in rochester.  when it first happened, i instantly felt bad for all the Muslims in the world...especially in the USA.  just a few were rounded up - i knew it would be an inquisition.  of course the LAW confused sikhs with Muslims.  it was sad.  i was traumatized through the whole thing.  i still am.  i'm not on any political sides in this war.  i would die with the soldiers and marines, proudly if i was in the military.  probably as a Chaplin or in the infantry...more or less as a brother for them...support...moral and spiritual support.  i'm not a fan of the anti-war movement - even though there should be no wars at all.  it's all in christs name and allah's.  it's all pretty unholy.  it's opposite of christ and were suppose to be a "christian" nation.  go figure.  it is NOT a holy war. infants are holy, bugs and deer and a birds are holy.  NOT war. either are the anti-war zealots who do not know the first thing about peace.  i THINK real Jihad is spiritual and NOT THE PHYSICAL.  i'm not into publicly bashing bush - i'm not a fan of bush at all.  this coming election scares the shit out of me - the far right and especially the far LEFT repulses me.  none of THEM speak for me.  most of the people in this country could give two shits about voting or peace.  they all have political agendas.  especially the professors in colleges whether they go to fucking harvard or if there major is international relations at ORAL ROBERTS UNIVERSITY.  i'm deeply offended ALL of the time - from the morning news to fox news to yoga journal workshops.  it's too elitist and way too cliquey.   the rainbow flag does not speak for me...i weep and pray for people in prison, the dispossessed and the meek.  wealth is a good thing..i am learning BUT not everybody has it.  i am big into loyalty from a partner.  there is NONE in my generation.  the majority live vicariously and there always setting up themselves to be disappointed and to go on to somebody that is better and more FUN.  i am not a misogynist but enough is enough.  i think were equal now.  the genders, i mean.  i am for gay rights but not the politics...i covered the gay marriage thing in boston, and all i could think about was - if you put this fucking energy into the poor and the suffering inner city and the black man and woman or black women with HIV then you would have something.  well you have the first lesbian marriage in boston and the first divorce or separation from the same couple that started the movement.  nowadays in my generation you have to compete with TWO genders.  a man and a woman.  just to find a partner.  what else to you want to know?  thanks for your kindness pattye.

    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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  •  03-31-2007, 8:47 PM 21329 in reply to 21319

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Dear Zenwolf:    First of all,   Welcome!  You really have come to the right place.

    That sounds like marketing but it is not.  Something got you here.  What was it. You have all the symptoms of needing exactly what brings people to their knees.  Keep yearning  because your soul yearns for the LORD.  You said that, not me-not anyone here.  You are not going to find what you believe in because as KW says, a very small percentage of the world is at a level where they know to yearn and if they do not or we do not as a collective all over the world, we most likely will blow ourselves up.  Another symptom is that you will cry more and you will laugh more as you stay true to yourself and tell others the truth.

    What have you read by Wilber?  What work are you doing now? 
    Do you feel you are in the middle of a deep depression or maybe a very dark night?

    Were you not able to continue as a camera man because of malaise.  Are you able to

    function and stay focused.  Tired all the time or do you just sit down an bawl someitmes when you see more of our young men being killed and maimed.  Do you feel guilty for not  being there.   If you prefer, you can write me an e-mail but I suspect that what you have to say is helpful for us all and you do seem to be willing to do that.  The most important thing I need to know now is the above and what you expected to get from joining Integral.    I am going to write another Post and tell you a couple of things that happened to me .  It may be tomorrow.  Depends on how the  time goes in the next hour.     Remember this.   "You cannot be abandoned" esp since you are on your way.  It just not feel like that.   Thanks Pattye

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  •  04-02-2007, 6:06 AM 21373 in reply to 21329

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord," is part of a pslam taken from th bible.  It is not mine...but it is one of my favorite quotes.

    What brought me to Integral?  i actually went to a Caroline Myss book signing and bought her book, "Entering the Castle."  I read Ken Wilburs introduction so I looked him up on the internet.  That is how I got here.  I have never read any of  Ken's work, BUT I do have his book, "A Theory of EvErything." i am going to try to read it this week. 

    I just feel the world is very hostile.  where all connected and sometimes i just don't want to be connected anymore. 

    i am still a photgrapher and moved back home to upstate ny -for myself and also to help out my folks.  my father has ALS and my mother is the caregiver.  so they need someone to buy groceries and stuff...it is tough as shit seeing my parents go thru all of this.  i especially worry about my mother.

    here is my website if you want to look at some of my pictures, pattye: http://www.slowcoolproductions.com

    write back pattye - love to hear from you.

    God bless...

    Joshua Morrell

    joshmorrell@yahoo.com

     

     


    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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  •  04-02-2007, 8:48 PM 21394 in reply to 21373

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Josh:  I just wrote a very long Post.  I may not have punched it.  I am so tired.  If I did not then I will write an email.   tomorrow.   I am so sorry if it does not come in.

    Pattye.  I will be in touch tomorrow .

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  •  04-07-2007, 2:22 PM 21520 in reply to 21394

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Hi Josh:   First I lost a post and then I had the wrong e address and finally discovered it had been changed.  I wlll go  over the tapes later that way.  I think I want to do that differently. Hope all is going well and I promise that I will finally write something this weekend.  Well, I will do the best I can.   What kind of practice are you doing now?    I realize that caring for your parents is a big part of that and it seems that you may have time for all of the newness of I-I also.  I am not sure about that and so please let me know what kind of time you have to put in.   I know that if you give this a chance, you will never be sorry.  Patience is needed since it cannot all be inhaled as quickly as some of the books and tapes out there.  Not that they do not have something to teach (some do not) but the research that has been done by

    KW is over twenty years old or he wrote his first book when he was in his twenties and has explored so many area's that are necessary for us to grow through many states and stages that will never be mentioned somewhere else.   He calls his work

    a map.  The map is not the territory.    Later Pattye

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  •  04-09-2007, 3:30 AM 21568 in reply to 21520

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    hi pattye...i have a regular practice...formally in the mornings and at night with meditation and prayer and lectio divina - which is spiritual reading.  i like to get up early between 3am and 5am...but it always does not work out that way.  i then after my practice -stretch do some hatha yoga and then go for a run with my dog - lola - for about 4 miles.  i am lucky and blessed.  i went thru a violent spiritual transformation about a year and a half to almost 2 years ago that solidified my practice and made my seeking permeanent and it helped my faith and strenghthed my foundation.

    i am going to read and start kens book, "the theory of everything" - today...take care all - and pattye a big hug and thanks - josh

    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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  •  04-09-2007, 11:24 PM 21628 in reply to 21568

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Big hug to you also Josh.  I would love to know your story whenever you feel like telling it or if you do.  I am sure it will bring up some thoughts from mine.  I don't do that that often and I do feel that it can be useful if we are not identified with it.  I also wondering about your cooking.  Is that authentic Italian food or everything.  And I almost forgot.  I went to your web site and the photgraphs are really so beautiful.  Maybe you could get a job at Integral. Someone who has gotten an award for photography and is a cook also is a great combination.  If I could afford you, I would hire you.  I always thought I wanted a wife but when I watched the "West Wing" and saw Charlie, the Presidents body person who was with him every moment at the White House and on all trips, I decided I wanted a body person instead.  You are welcome to stay her if you come to Florida.  I am sure you will meet some young women at Daytona Beach.  I have a daughter there who has a family.  She is teacher and you could also stay with her.  And you might even meet someone here in Ocala.   What did you do in DC?  Are you anxious to get back to the work you were doing, or is it going fairly well taking care of your parents.  How far along is your Dad with the Alzhiemers and does your sister come up also.  Is there only one sister?  I am so nosy.  You know you answer only what you want. 

    Have you read about the ILP kit?  If not I want to tell you about that even tho you can find it on the site.   How are you coming with navigating all the places here.

    Later.  Love Pattye

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  •  04-10-2007, 9:36 AM 21638 in reply to 21628

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    pattye - everybody has a story and i really do not feel like telling mine yet...my father has lou gehrigs diease/ALS -NOT alzhemers...his mind is lucid and clear.  i am not taking care of my parents - my mother is the principle care giver to my father NOT i...i meaning ME gets grocerieries for them the post office - menial - things that they cannot do since my Mother never leaves my fathers side.  my mother and father have been home bound NOW for about a year and a half. 

    i just started reading Ken's book integral spirtuality.  good book - however i am only on page 40 or so.  I read the introduction to the book and the "cliff notes' on the broader "philosophy' of integral spirtuality.  the book is good.  the charts and graphs confuse me a little and it is very sophisticated talk - but very interesting. 

    i just interviewed for a landscaping job - FULL TIME - and 52 weeks a year.  i think i am going to leave my cooking job and take the landscaping job...less money but better hours and after 3 months health benefits.  i have a couple of opputunitys to get back into television news BUT after struggling a bit with my decisions and tossing it back and forth, "should I or shouldn't i get back into Television news..."  the answer i came up with - of course-  was absolutly NO.  i cannot.  even if the money is subsatntially better and the health benefits and of course vacation and dental.  i just can't see getting back into a medium that i don't believe in - TO MY VERY CORE.  too solatious and way too much of an irresponsible power in the world.  tv freaking news - now there is an abomination.  it is a tough decision, though - because i was one of the GOOD ones.  i mean it is not a mistake that freedom of the press is in the constitution.  i was and still am a helluva of a cameraman with a great vision and i can tell a great story.  a true one - not a story just for ratings or telling and showing the story because of what I think the f-ing herd needs to hear.  the tv-culture is too much for me and my ideals and morals OUT weigh the good i could do in tv.  i am sick of mass-media and it is training and killing the culture.

    pattye - you said you wanted a WIFE - now it is none of my business - but i thought you were once married and are a women...i think you were trying to be funny - but hey there is nothing wrong with a partnership in life - no matter if you are gay, straight or transgendered...i just don't believe in the politics of relationships..meaning BROADCASTING or "constituting" partnerships in life and the in your face of gay marriage or the in your face of the anti gay marriage people...i am so sick of it.  and it is hard to ignore the media...you know what i mean?

    anyway  - i hope none of you very nice and intelligent people are taking offense to anything i say or write down - i am just - not a huge fan - on where the world is going right now...that is why i tend to dwell in the "interior.'  and i do not think there is anything wrong with it - a quiet contemplative life....take care - paz - josh



    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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  •  04-10-2007, 3:26 PM 21649 in reply to 21638

    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    Hi Josh:  I will try to address as much as I can here.  No I meant a "Wife" because all of the details that most women take care of for thier "man and children".  It is some different today and that is good, however, many women seem to be juggling more that ever.   I am definitely interested in men as life parteners. We ( my husband and I (divorced) had 5 children and now there are ten grandchildren.  He had a huge character defect and chose not to do anything about it.  And I identified with the family Life more than anything else so you can imagiane what I had to go through to disidentify with that.  I had the good fortune to know two wonderful men who really loved me and because of circumstances we actually  (or they) even had what it took to be true to the vows that they had chosen to live earlier in Life.  One was a decicated family man and the other a very dedicated person also.   Very rare in this time to stay committed and it has a very Grace/ful way of showering Blessings on those involved.  Cannot be proved but that was my experience.

    There are all kinds of ways that people deal with these kinds of relationships and I do believe that as long as we are very very honest and true to certain boundaries that may only apply to two at that time, there is much redemption.

    I am so sorry about your dad.  Imust have looked at the ALS and thought it was ALZ.  That is just horrendous but I am so glad that you can have hin in your life

    in his sweetness and love.  I also had a wonderful father and I would not give one day that I stayed and cared for him.  And it was not always easy as mother was sick at the same time. And I drove 700 miles one way to be there and then back to FL over and over.   Service is the best of the "Practice".   More on that later.  And I was just reading KW, had had my own experiences, was putting one foot in front of the other, day by day and did not always feel so good health wise.  Pretty tiring and very hard work.  And there were always problems back home in Ocala.  It was a nite mare.

    There are a couple of men that can help you on this site.  Not because they are men

    but because they "get" a lot of the heavy stuff. KW walked us through the book IS

    before it was published which was a real help and I still am re-reading it.  It took me forever on a couple of the big points.  I urge you to get "Grace and "Grit" and/or "One Taste"  (( a journal  of his day to day)  with other good stuff added, and you can pick that up when your head starts  to hurt from reading IS;  ANd the tapes and

    vidio clips are really helpful.   WE were able to call in with questions during the reading of the book, if we signed up.  But I did not even know the questions to ask.

    Those are all on file and will be very helpful.  You can find them Chapter by CHapter. And just recently,  people from this site were able to call in as we re-did chapter by chapter.  So you will have that extra help.   May your family be blessed

    with Loving Kindness and please know that I treasure our "WE" space.   Much Love

    Pattye

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  •  04-10-2007, 6:40 PM 21659 in reply to 21649

    • Zenwolf is not online. Last active: 01-21-2008, 8:56 PM Zenwolf
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    Re: I meaning me not you BUT some of you...

    boy you are a nice gal - pattye...where the hell did you come from?  i told you before i got turned on to ken wilbers website and book from the forward to caroline myss's book, "entering the castle."  great forward and great book - although, i did not finish it yet.  BUT the point i am trying to make was carol myss has this hayhouse radio show on hayhouse .com.  it is very interesting...carol freaks me out sometimes but i have a feeling and a good hunch she knows what she is talking about and that she does not lie...a good teacher that likes to teach and she helped me out a lot.  anyway - her last episode on her radio show was about the 'forgotten homemaker."  now make sue you understand me because lord knows we have to be politically correct with everything nowadys - she was talking about - i did not hear the entire show but she touched on it a couple of weeks ago - how the "homemaker" archytype is being shunned and basically hidden now.  i think being a parent homemaker - freaking man or woman - is a great triumphant calling...i personally think they are the true heros of the world - without a doubt.  anyway - you remind me of that archetype...i hate to sound so surgical or sterile - using the word archetype because you are a validated - subjective feeling real person - but you totally remind me of that mindset.

    that is one of the problems i think that scares people away from spirtulity or getting involved in ANYTHIING these days - the total INVALIDATION of a human beings subjective experience and being part of a whole but the part BEING THEMSELVES and original.  it is so sad - sometimes - when you knock people and peoples subjective experiences and dumb it down to sterile, surgical and medical sounding words.  for instance like f-ing archtypes, cognitive, validation, bipolar, inomsomnia, weirdo, homemaker, spy, pirate - you know what i mean.  Surgical, sterile defintions for a human being that makes people FEEL they are not worth shit.  i hate it.  especially when you get it from your peers or an unqualified jack ass...I hate being put in a box or a bottle and have a post it note attached to me and some one telling me I AM THIS...you know what i mean jelly bean?

    Paz and later - josh
    love our threads pattye - i hope other people join in....

    "Like a deer that yearns for running streams so my soul yearns for you my Lord..."
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