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The Bilderberg Group

Last post 07-01-2008, 8:25 PM by innerline. 39 replies.
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  •  06-07-2008, 5:15 PM 54812 in reply to 54808

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Innerline:

    Robert Anton Wilson is not green goo - he is Indigo goo :)

    I follow your point that our monetary system makes us blind to true value.

    And we can agree that the monetary system we now have is a LR system that operates independently, to a great degree, from communal LL or individual UR concerns about true value.

    I think we can all see how it is useful to agree upon a common LR currency. And we can also agree that this monological reality allows for all kinds of immorality and "evil" conduct to thrive.

    So, let me ask you:

    take the reality of the world today, where we have a rampant LR monetary system.

    How do you get to a LL monetary system that accounts for true value without doing damage to the interests that are currently thriving in the LR system (e.g. the Bilderbergers)? That is the preferable route, yes?

    If you cannot get there without doing damaging to those interests, how do you get to that LL value system you refer to anyway? What would have to happen for this to come about?

    Say you are the President and wanted to do this. What steps would you take specifically? You have 4 years and the clock is ticking ......

     

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  •  06-07-2008, 5:19 PM 54813 in reply to 54808

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    innerline:
    And your point with that adastra. You just through green goo at me. Your on a integral forum so try, please try and be integral. A sea of green.

    Wilson does not want to expose but wants people to see that conspiracy is normal behavior and that there's no one big cospiracy that runs everything. 

    Great now conspiracy is normal, just not one big one. Whew thank God.

    adastra, is there something specific about whats been said on this post that you do not think is true?


    Jest throwing something in the stewpot, Innerline.  If you find it indigestible, leave it on your plate.  Smile [:)]  

    Personally I find "green" perspectives true but partial, and Robot Antwerp Wilcon a lovable, amusing fellow (now sadly deceased).  He charmingly refused to take anyone, including himself, too seriously.  I follow a similar policy, with wildly varying degrees of success.  namaste.

    Thank god we have "green" to hurl at each other as an insult, eh?  Sometimes when someone does that, I - with tongue in cheek - shoot back, "Oh, what a teal thing to say!" 

    “The shock of discovering that most of the power in the world is held by ignorant and greedy people can really bum you out at first; but after you've lived with it a few decades, it becomes, like cancer and other plagues, just another problem that we will solve eventually if we keep working at it.” - Robert Anton Wilson

    “Intelligence is the capacity to receive, decode and transmit information efficiently. Stupidity is blockage of this process at any point. Bigotry, ideologies etc. block the ability to receive; robotic reality-tunnels block the ability to decode or integrate new signals; censorship blocks transmission.” - Robert Anton Wilson

    “If you think you know what the hell is going on, you're probably full of shit.” - Robert Anton Wilson  [lol]

    holding "it" lightly,
    Arthur


    I am seeking meaningful work.

    bio: http://aqalicious.gaia.com/

    I spend most of my "forum time" these days on The Integral Pod: http://pods.gaia.com/ii/

    "You've never seen everything." - Bruce Cockburn
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  •  06-08-2008, 5:49 PM 54878 in reply to 54813

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Hi all,

    I often hear Ken Wilber name dropping the movers and shakers of the political intelligensia, and their uptake of integral theory. There is obviously some practical and noble realism in this - influencing the powerful in order to disseminate wisdom to the masses. It would certainly harm his cause to posit the idea that these individuals may play some part of an elite that is really about maintaing control and power. Such a complex area

    My gut sense is that integral theory misses an important stage in its model of developmental theory. That is that at the begining of orange meme development, there is also an occult and esoteric awakening. This idea has been popularised (and bastardised) by the Da vinci code phenomena but nonetheless points to a fundamental realisation. While the captains of science and industry in the 17th/18th centural presented a public face of reason, science, equalitry and entrepreneurialism, the main figures (Franklin, Newton, Voltaire to name but a few) were steeped in a fraternal and mystical tradition that elevated an elite and plutocraticic ideal, based on the ancient mystery schools and their understanding of mass psychospiritual wisdom (and potential manipulation thereby).

    It is significant that out of this era grew the early parliaments and banking institutions that have propogated the worlds modern 'democratic' systems.

    It is easy to characterise this as a simplistic 'conspiracy theory' that neglects the complexity of modern politics, and the ability of the human mind to deceive itself with paranoic speculation.

    However, speaking from what I hope is a truly 'integral' perspective, I see no conflict in the co existence of complexity, human falability AND covert and organised operations by a power elite with mainly self interest at heart.

    Belief in 'conspiracy' 'theory' is not always the presence of regressive or shadow dynamics within the individual, but perhaps a recognition of how global power structures naturally form themselves in reponse to the collective pathology of our species.

    just some thoughts
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  •  06-08-2008, 6:01 PM 54881 in reply to 54878

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Aldous:

    What would you propose?

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  •  06-09-2008, 12:56 AM 54910 in reply to 54881

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Hi schalk
    schalk:

    Aldous:

    What would you propose?



    Hi schalk,

    I think the question of 'what to do' always boils down to the courage and integrity of the individual to take their power back. As you have stated earlier, there is always a correlation between corruption and complicity. I am optimistic that things are changing anyway - I coudnt talk about this stuff 10 years ago without being considered inceridibly starange!

    In the integral scheme of things, the best we can do is build a better map of how reality works. Rather than getting lost in the rabbit hole of Bilderberg, banking scams and false flag operations, I think we need some general historical perspective. I would start with developmental theory. There is a base assumption that belief and understanding in occult and mystical revelation takes a sabatical at the rational/scientific stage of development. Maybe it does for the masses, who are educated to limit their scope of possibility to the five senses and the body (thus becoming perfect consumers etc). But the higher you climb the pyramid, you find influential people who not surprisingly hoard that knowledge for themselves.

    In a way integral theory provides the underpinning for this stuff. As Orange rationonalism moves away from mythic membership and allegence to the king, or your genetic group, you find enterprising people who honour corporate power above ethnic identity. When people try to debunk the idea of 911 as an inside job, you often hear the line "...But 'they' would never do that to 'their own' people!". I would argue that in the unhealthy expression of this line of development, such concerns are irrelevant.

    Their is such a disparity between what the common man thinks is significant (left/right politics, consensus history, simplistic economics) and the true reality of governance, that most people are left politically impotent.

    Again this is not black and white - there are people in levels of government who have genuine and good intentions.'We' as the people are complicit in the situation AND there is an objective structure of covert control 'out there'. Lets look at them both.

    we live in a world of limited self knowledge and an erroneous conception of how governance truly operates. Integral theory is very well placed to reverse that situation.
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  •  06-09-2008, 9:23 AM 54922 in reply to 54812

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    This post is getting good. Thanks shalk for giving me the time of day. I think someone can be Indigo and in expression  still make many  of the subtle reductionism. I feel it is garanteed when I/We express ourselves. Like a funnel with the most space at top and then comes out a narrow bottom.

    Non the less we/I are in this movement of pure awareness to self reflection to choice to movement.

    If I were president I would first see that what Orange stands for has been focused in the it domain and can equally be apllied to the I and we domains. I think that minds that are dissatisfied with orange do not know the full potential of orange. Since our constitution is an awsome expression of Orange and is an adaptable document. People sometimes see the constittution as not dynamic, it is, its modern. It can handle our problems today. We just need to use it with the potential that modern life is expressing now. Computers can make it so  we do not have people running government (not that I would want it this way). The peoples input is currently four,two,once a year. Yet imagine voting on legislation (which we don't get to do) every week. That people would want to get informed just because they have been given an opportunity to vote and everyhuman would want to make an informed choice. We have a powerful conscience when it is put in the situation to use it no matter what level your at.

    I would get rid of the FED Bank and drop all debt. I would make a four year transition plan into a modern monetary system which their are now many examples/models that are far from being put to use, like time based economies. I would work on modernizing the government, basically take out all the middle men and start using our technology. I would put the idea out that the use of nuclear fusion with H3 from the moon will allow humanity to live at current populations, and possibly many more, or end up in a massive famine. The use of alternative energy was a good take off point in the 70's and we are way behind the ball with this, thus nuclear fusion( Very safe, compared to nuclear fission). I would move the power to local communties and make the governments job upkeeping whatever networks keep the communities connected. The movement to value communties.

      I would apoligize to the world for how the USA government has treated them. That the best good with other countries comes from the relationship and not through control and military. America was supposed to be a beakon not a parasite. And a beakon has to have its nation together just to be able to radiate.

    Man has realized we can not compete for space since all of the planet is inhabited, pretty much.(we do have a battle for the northpoles resorces going on right now). After WWII we realized this. We have not realized that, we can not compete in limited time. This is a way out their idea, that is grounded for me. You see, with money and debt and risk we are playing with time, and the people we are effecting are not here yet to say anything. Thus we have a battle against Nazi germany but instead of space it is time, making it not a battle between nations but humanity and God. That is the oldest battle so to say since it clearly has its expression in birth and death. If we lose the awakening battle (compared to the space battle)Humanity is dead or at small numbers. If we win then we get to see a new horizon that is a sentient being awakening to its journey through different intensities of time. We will evolve into a human that sees itself as a universal being and not just an earthy one.

    As far as the bildebergs go , they will use the options that would be their to stay in the old system(options in the transition period). Kumanity  ,I hope,   would just be able to act beyond their influence. Their influence is very great in the money, debt, risk , time competition. It would be negligable in the system I envision.

    The clock is ticking....

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  •  06-09-2008, 9:25 AM 54924 in reply to 54910

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Aldous:

    You have touched on a very dicey topic.

    I agree with you that much of what we see "in the world" is likely a smoke screen generated by very smart people with very real interests that are furthered by our collection diversion of interest.

    The very topics discussed on the news are cherry-picked to keep us distracted.

    You suggest that Integral could do more to flesh this out and show how it operates.

    I suspect that one important consideration is this: Integral does not operate without considerations for the perceptions of important people on the horizon. Integral theory is the first vision in the post-modern world to make sense of everything we know. And as such, it is a fragile and developing flower. You want to make sure it blossoms and survives.

    There are many people who could put a serious dent in the Integral Institute's functioning.

    One way of ensuring that this doesn't happen is to refrain from having Integral even remotely appear to threaten the economic or power interests of "important" people.

    When we are threatened, we immediately look for the light that casts the threat in the most unfavorable way, so as to discredit it and marginalize it on the fringe. Much of politics is simply choosing light that creates maximum marginalization of the opponent.

    Conspiracy and occult and illuminati and esoterica and secret rites and skull and bones and ... we can go on and on about very real phenomena that probably play a much greater role than we like to acknowledge in shaping the world we live in and allocating resources.

    But, you come upon the problem of evidence. How do you talk about this and set forth convincing evidence that will withstand attempts to discredit the talk?

    I recently "proved" that the Queen of England was responsible for having Di and Dodi killed under Pont D'Alma in Paris. The rigorousness of my evidence would not satisfy most people however. It was all myth talk.

    I am free to pursue such flights of imagination. But Integral is not.

    So, if we start trying to unmask the Bilderbergers and the New World Order and Skull and Bones and the Bamboo Union and the Illuminati and the Rosicrucians, Integral becomes an enormous target that will be manipulated and attacked and discredited and unfairly characterized and .... the flower will be crushed.

    Also, Integral will attract many people who have no interest in Integral per se, but who are amount that group of the population who, as Robert Anton Wilson put it, would become extremely paranoid if you told them that tomorrow is Tuesday! They are out there and wired this way it seems. Does this crowd help the Integral vision grow?

    I hate the notion of refraining from exploring anything that may be true and provable with evidence. But my sense is that Integral has made a deliberate choice to not permit itself to be cast as an opponent of anything. Not that it would be fair in an Integral model to say that Integral is opposed to anything. By definition it is not. But that is not how the game works when interpretations begin. When you are dealing with power and threats to it, anything goes and it isn't necessarily fair.

    As for a new development level after Orange that accounts for esoteric knowledge, what are some of the key features that characterise it that are not accounted for now?

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  •  06-09-2008, 10:19 AM 54926 in reply to 54924

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    schalk:

    Aldous:

    You have touched on a very dicey topic.

    I agree with you that much of what we see "in the world" is likely a smoke screen generated by very smart people with very real interests that are furthered by our collection diversion of interest.

    The very topics discussed on the news are cherry-picked to keep us distracted.

    You suggest that Integral could do more to flesh this out and show how it operates.

    I suspect that one important consideration is this: Integral does not operate without considerations for the perceptions of important people on the horizon. Integral theory is the first vision in the post-modern world to make sense of everything we know. And as such, it is a fragile and developing flower. You want to make sure it blossoms and survives.

    There are many people who could put a serious dent in the Integral Institute's functioning.

    One way of ensuring that this doesn't happen is to refrain from having Integral even remotely appear to threaten the economic or power interests of "important" people.

    When we are threatened, we immediately look for the light that casts the threat in the most unfavorable way, so as to discredit it and marginalize it on the fringe. Much of politics is simply choosing light that creates maximum marginalization of the opponent.

    Conspiracy and occult and illuminati and esoterica and secret rites and skull and bones and ... we can go on and on about very real phenomena that probably play a much greater role than we like to acknowledge in shaping the world we live in and allocating resources.

    But, you come upon the problem of evidence. How do you talk about this and set forth convincing evidence that will withstand attempts to discredit the talk?

    I recently "proved" that the Queen of England was responsible for having Di and Dodi killed under Pont D'Alma in Paris. The rigorousness of my evidence would not satisfy most people however. It was all myth talk.

    I am free to pursue such flights of imagination. But Integral is not.

    So, if we start trying to unmask the Bilderbergers and the New World Order and Skull and Bones and the Bamboo Union and the Illuminati and the Rosicrucians, Integral becomes an enormous target that will be manipulated and attacked and discredited and unfairly characterized and .... the flower will be crushed.

    Also, Integral will attract many people who have no interest in Integral per se, but who are amount that group of the population who, as Robert Anton Wilson put it, would become extremely paranoid if you told them that tomorrow is Tuesday! They are out there and wired this way it seems. Does this crowd help the Integral vision grow?

    I hate the notion of refraining from exploring anything that may be true and provable with evidence. But my sense is that Integral has made a deliberate choice to not permit itself to be cast as an opponent of anything. Not that it would be fair in an Integral model to say that Integral is opposed to anything. By definition it is not. But that is not how the game works when interpretations begin. When you are dealing with power and threats to it, anything goes and it isn't necessarily fair.

    As for a new development level after Orange that accounts for esoteric knowledge, what are some of the key features that characterise it that are not accounted for now?



    Hi Schalk, thanks for your feedback.

    I agree that integral has to be careful in not making enemies. However, I would also argue the oposite case - there are many 'apathetic' people screaming out for an approach that answers their questions and makes sense of their vague feeling that something is not right in the world. The establishment certainly has the power to marginalise and discredit, but at some point there will be too many people to marginalise (we will be in the majority). These are exciting times.

    I dont think integral needs to 'name names' as such or directly address  bilderberg etc - as you imply, this stuff is like quantum physics - the more you try to pin it down the more ambiguous and unprovable it becomes. It is not integrals place to expose criminality or seek humanitarian justice. It is however an approach that seeks to expand human understanding and explore where we have come from and where we are going, even if that takes us to some very dark places. The emphasis on shadow work within the integral movement is essential - why not extend it to covert government activity?

    I think we need to accept that an occult conspiracy will have its roots in history and human development - hense my call to modify the integral model. I was just questioning the assumption that anything transcendent or mystical was immediatly dismissed by orange. This is simply not true in the case of may of the figureheads who ushered in this wave. They in turn were preceeded by preistly classes (going back as far as Babylon) who offered a distorted exoteric picture to the masses while using and often abusing a supirior esoteric knowledge.

    Im not talking about creating a new colour in the spectrum of development -  just maybe  looking at sub sections of  development that reflect power differencials and abuse thereof.

    thanks
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  •  06-09-2008, 10:38 AM 54928 in reply to 54926

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Aldous:

    I think I see what you are referring to. We don't properly appreciate the role of deliberate, intentional covert activity on the part of identifiable groups at various points in history.

    One man's conspiracy is another man's cooperation in making the world a better place, right? 

    Let me ask though: is it possible that the Orange structures you are referring to constructed esoterica programs based upon altered states of consciousness (I'm not referring to drugs, but organic state experiences that are profound or esoteric through ritual and rites and the like)?

    There are untold permutations on the ways humanity have had horizontally rich combinations of experience and translated those experiences at the vertical level of development where they reside.

    I am thinking that our metaphor on power structures needs to be re-thought. We often think of power in terms of vertical hierarchies. The man on the top and us on the bottom. Top down leadership. Etc.

    From an Integral perspective, power functions on a horizontal plane. Power is centralized and influence radiates from those centers, but they are often moving in a translating, horizontal way rather than a transcending, vertical way.

    One can be "subjected" to power and it is like the power inpacts you or washes over you at your ankles only, with the remainder of your being and identity standing higher and virtually unrecognized by those who think they "own" you.

    What examples of covert action appear to you to be more than just new permutations on this horizontal "same level" translation? Which ones do we need to know more about to understand from an Integral perspective how the Kosmos operates?  

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  •  06-09-2008, 12:34 PM 54938 in reply to 54928

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Schalk,

    You stated"One can be "subjected" to power and it is like the power inpacts you or washes over you at your ankles only, with the remainder of your being and identity standing higher and virtually unrecognized by those who think they "own" you."

    I see it that they ,the power elite, own our ignorance of the remainder. And if we do not wake up to this, then we default to the game at the ankles. Which works perfect for them. So they do own us in the collective with our ignorace. A individual is not limited in development but will still have to use the systems that are at the ankles. When the collective awakens then the game can easily be made for greater verticality. Integral has all the tools to awaken someone to the depth of the demensions of being. Bringing the same depth of I/We/it into the money awareness has been the most amazing use of integral awareness. And how "power to the people" is thwarted by hidding power in a monlithic structure, so simple that it can easily be unseen.

    Can the elite get away from universal law? Of corse not.

    "One man's conspiracy is another man's cooperation in making the world a better place, right?"

    Right! The elite were awakened to the full power of Orange and saw the masses as not intelligent to bring evolution foward. A progressive bent for the masses they had. They did not envision themselves NOT having to do this function. Evolution has it so they don't keep doing it. A good steward for one unfoldment is the gate keeper for the next. We don't see the gate then the gates stay closed. They have been the stewards and now they don't want to be the gate keepers. So we have people not being able to see the gate (Integral has come just in time for this. But the Elite also don't want to be gate keepers but stay stewards.

    The Elite are really scared of the collective ignorance and did not work to change this but just control it. Just as I am very scared of the collective ignorance.

    If we can see the gate then the elite would have to be gate keepers. Not understanding money lets the Elite do a slight of hand with the collective wealth. Embodying integral and envisioning a economy to match, is us seeing the gate. We do this on a collective scale and we can start entering the next golden age. I beleive we are in the perfect situation right now with the credit,  food, and energy problems to awaken. Many have awoken, that are not close to Integral cognition. They just want the elite out and can envision Orange monetary systems. So either an individual awakens and knows something is wrong, and knows more about power in the LR than Integral, but does not having the depth of a Integral perspective. Then we have the smart people that are clueless about how money works in the LR. A key element in Integral or green to be effective is this knowledge of money in the LR. There are more people awake to the monetary system than there are people Integrally aware. Could these two awareness come together so Integral is not just raising individuals conscousness and/but leaving them in an external vacuum as far as power is concerned in the LR. So integral will work for those who are financially free(time free), for the rest just keep working(time) in a system that is unfullfilling and meaningless other than for the neccessities of life. A chicken in a chicken coup as far as time is concerned. I wonder how many people would do their job if it did not pay money? Our vitality is connected to our creativity and we are wasting alot of human vitality (wealth) in the systems we have now. Loss of vitality is the process of recognizing death. So our civilization is dying, and will we have ground (both internal and real earth) to grow the next civilization? Think this one will keep going like this? Not with the dollar, oil and food issues.. The riots have begun around the world and this will give more power to make a global totalitarian civilization. It a viscoius circle we have entered and it will end with either a shift up or down. I hope its a shift up. I pray Gandi's methods are used. Staying in one's power is a radical act.

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  •  06-09-2008, 1:45 PM 54947 in reply to 54938

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    I love to hear this kind of talk. It assumes that human life is worth protecting from enslavement and devitalization.

    It gets into the issue of sovereignty over one's life.

    Out where I live, there are people called Freemen who have a lot of concerns in this regard. Many of the acts they perform are very objectionable, but the concern they have about the elites sapping our lives and vitality through distractions and what are essentially lies is very worth of consideration. (They are usually in trouble with the FBI too, so just for the record, I don't personally know any Freemen though I have defended a few of them in court on various charges.)

    McCain has a tendency to talk this way as well. That is why he scares a lot of the right. They don't trust him to not expose their game.

    McCain was raised in a military family and is about the closest thing we have to someone who functions from "core values." I don't get the sense that his wife's business interests sway him all that much.

    (There is no more independent person than an old Navy guy. Look at Admiral Fallon or Admiral Grace Hopper. They scare the Army Generals with their straight talk.)

    I am not seeing how Obama's left support (the ones with the money) are any more interested than the CEO of Haliburton in redefining value and helping us awaken to our inherent right to be alive.

    What do you see as being the next big step in the direction you are pointing? Other than talking about the issue?

    And what about my earlier question - how do you get from a LR monetary system that is based on naked quantities to a LL monetary system that includes consideration of human meaning?

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  •  06-09-2008, 3:21 PM 54956 in reply to 54947

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Schalk it comes down to or up to time. A time based system can very easily be used in a local community, and some intentional communities already are. That a persons time is the unit of value and not time to money. And not all persons time is equal, people can make contracts on this, just like money. Its a great study and takes alot more than I can giving you. It takes care of the neccessities for everyone not depending on anything but being alive. A credit system that gives everyone a base salary in a way. In this system the greatest resource will be seen as Human and not oil, money and power. Cause we will see that it all comes down to service and why would we do services that do not come back to serving us. Its simple. Humanity has not gotten there. We are here to serve each other. Wow. We are hear to have deep fufilling relationships. How can we do this when most everyone is tired by doing things that just get them by in time. No vitality for deep listening and presence. We need each other like we need food.  

    McCain has that power but just like presidents of the past say one thing, do another, mccain will have a good talk for orange but will increase the Military industrial complex and the Debts and the fraud. The fraud needs to keep going at this point. Obama (just on being him) will cause a collapse and bring what we are not ready for at all. I think three more years will be enough for people to be ready to move based on like minded communities. The food and energy issues will force this very practical move. The food and energy issue can also be used to enslave us. Our civilzation has grow based on Oil and freedom. The next civilization will grow based on the idea of sustainability. In a sense fully centered in Orange instead of our red core and amber,orange, and green waves. Once orange is our core then green can take off trully, and integral. Subtle energy selling fits so well with time based economies its beautiful. I have the vision! Will it become a collective vision?

    Schalk, I recommend this website to start seeing the LL with this. www.carolynbaker.net

    I need to go eat.

     

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  •  06-09-2008, 4:15 PM 54960 in reply to 54956

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Which part of the Baker site should I read first on the issue of moving from LR to LL monetary policy?

    Can you tell me in your own words how this will work, in real simple terms?

    Example: we need steel. The iron is located in 3 places, A, B, and C nations. Nation D is paying each of those nations substantial amounts of money per ton for their iron mining rights. How do we get iron without paying at least what Nation D is paying?

    Are you suggesting that we should learn to do without steel or that we should use different monetary units to pay for steel?

    There is not a lot of oil where I live. How exactly do I guarantee a steady supply of oil to my neighborhood so I can get to work 10 miles away each day? Are you suggesting bicycles?

    I am not clear on the solution here. Help me out.

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  •  06-09-2008, 9:26 PM 54986 in reply to 54956

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    "Cause we will see that it all comes down to service and why would we do services that do not come back to serving us.  Its simple.   Humanity has not gotten there. We are here to serve each other.  Wow  We are hear to have deep fulllfilling relationships.  How can we do this when most everyone is tired by doing things that just get them by in time.  No vitality for deep listening and presence.  We need each other like we  need food"

    OK Sportsfans,  Listen Up!    "All you Princes of Maine"  and however that goes.

    It is definitely possible to serve when services do not come back to serving us.  That has been experienced by many.  Unless you consider the love of serving in an area that one is passionate about, for me that would be teaching and/or being present for deep listening.  Sometimes the return gives vitality back, most of the time I am thrilled to see or experience someone "get it".  Even if it is small.  That is always good advice.  Start small.  Or where you are.   If people cannot hear us then it is up to us to keep working at it until we say it in such a way that they do begin to hear.  And it is unacceptable not to have the vitality.    That is where exercise, rest, silence, good food, laughter, dance, good reads, movies etc etc come in.   My parents always felt that a USA president should be a young man who  is healthy and vital.  There are exceptions to everything but I get what they meant.   Now I can say "young person"

    instead of "young man".  Thanks Hillary.   She is young  at sixty.  From my perspective.  I cannot tell you how that makes many of us women feel.  And I am grateful for the first Black President.  Where are you Mary?   You sort of got it both ways.   I bet you are poppin with pride and I bet you have cried tears of love and Joy.  And I am so happy for you.  We will have to light a lot of candles for that young boy.   May he be protected and gain the wisdom he needs and surround himself with people who can help this country grow up some more.

     

    Someone ask Ken once if Auribindo would have made a good leader of his people sort of like the Pope is for Catholics.   Answer:  Absolutely Not.  His body was emaciated.  One has to be strong and healthy and vital to be able to manifest to such large groups who are looking for answers and to be led.  .  (I have more to say on that later)  That does not mean that Auribindo was not a very Holy Man with so much to give as his way of serving.    Humanitiy has not evolved to what we want to have yet.   One of the biggest insults of this last decade, at least to me and others I have talked with was naming a war  "Shock and Awe"  And to get a really good spot to televise  this   fireworks display from a building that was just perfect!! .  "Shock and Awe"   the Show of the Year.   Aimed at the Evil Empire.  How dare those clowns make that judgement against other people.  Many of them had studied in the US.  Were already beginning to think for themselves in new ways.  People from Iraq.

    And then there were the innocent children and old people with one of the World Religions that sustained them.   The fundamentalists were there.  The fundamentalists are here in the US also.  The beginning of terrorism.   So we start with taking care of "everyone is tired"   of yourself who is tired.   You must have a Practice.  You must have an Integral Practice.   That includes all the good stuff that will make you strong and vital at your potential.  And then you dance and laugh and work and play and start listening and being present with deep listening.  Or you ask for the same if you are impoverished in any of these ways, esp the last part.   You must be still to become wise.  You get wiser and wiser by being still.   Then you can start writing again with and getting it all down on paper- these thoughts that may be hopeful for others-  if that talent continues.   You will be surprised at what happens.  Right now there is an imbalance and that makes us tired and we do things that just get us by.

    Personally,  I have to see every moment of my life as prayer.  The stuff I really do not like to do.  Prayer.  Marriage is a Practice.   Relationship is a Practice. School is a Practice.   And then the Practice Map suggested by Integral that includes everything you need to get as healthy as possible.   We are ahead of the game since we know that People are the greatest resource.   We are really ahead of the game when sickness and trouble comes and performing services really do sap our energies because as St Theresa says via Carolyn Myess,   the soul becomes stronger than the body, has the vitalitiiy needed for an Aurobinda to keep teaching and being wise and a Ken Wilber to keep on "packing his gifts so millions will benefit" and all the time having to be very very careful to take care with exercise, good food etc etc.  And then you will act from your Passion which may very well be writing and giving hope and whatever else your gifts are.  These discussions are helpful.  Most of the time we do not know who is affected.  At age 72, I have had experiences that show me I am doing "the work" and it is a daily effort to stay with that grace and "The Practice"  and most of the time a daily Joy. There are Tears and Grief also. How fortunate that is.  How fortunate I am.  How fortunate you are to be here, to know what you know.

    If you want to know more,  I am here to be present and have deep listening.  There is one other huge part that I personally think is most important and is really just another way- a technique that works.   My problem now is that I have to have an operation- 99 % sure so  I will be back and forth.    I can tell you in my own words how it has worked for me and it will be another version of the Map but we need to know- we have to find the right stories and the right sources for our lives  that are  unique and the same.   Blessings and Love Pattye     Later.

    "And then there is the man who knows the price of everything and values Nothing."

    Oscar Wilde              That quote is for me for the week.

     

     

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  •  06-10-2008, 9:45 AM 55004 in reply to 54960

    Re: The Bilderberg Group

    Hi Schalk, You would have to move into a intentional community that has a time based economy. As far as raw materials are conerned we are looking at companies and institutions using the agreed upon method for exchange. The dollar is not going to stay the reserve currency of the world and so the issue of international exchange is a issue that is being talked about now and they will take care of that aspect. People can come together and agree on any medium of exchange. Does this answer your question? Communities can act as a whole for a service into the modern world thus getting a medium of exchange for that world. Take the internet model and invision a decentrilized network of nodes were a node can connect and join to any other node. Making one to one agreement that can follow genral patterns or not. The meta star configurations I see at the top of the page is a perfect expression of this.  Can you see local communities as seperate nodes, corporations, governments etc. We currently live in a centrilized nation state community and society that is trying to go global without changing the foundation for that level. The global economy is going ahead for international companies and not for nations and individuals. It will only work with universal rights that allow individual nodes to stand independent in responsibility and has the network to meet needs. The global politic is far from getting universal right excepted, since not one nation has done this for their people. I think Ken thought it could happen in 1,000 years. 

    Time overdue for a world currency
    by Hossein Askari and Noureddine Krichene

    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/JF06Dj04.html

     

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