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INTEGRAL LAW

Last post 08-20-2007, 4:22 PM by cgnost. 65 replies.
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  •  07-03-2006, 9:48 PM 831

    INTEGRAL LAW

    Hi, folks!  This is an issue near and dear to my heart, and, frankly, I need some high-powered help here myself.   And Gene, beat you to this topic, so let me hear from you!

    I'm functioning as I-I's unofficial in-house counsel for the moment, and without divulging anything privileged, I'd love to hear anyone's input as to how to be integrally-informed while dealing with the Blue/Orange coded practice/game of legal wrangling.  Try as we might, we are still dealing in a total adversarial contest.  I have some ideas, of course, but thought I might gather more of yo out there to assist me in fleshing this out.

    We've got one paper on Integral Law that will be in the AQAL Journal that i know of, and its author is writing another as we speak.  I'm researching an AQAL approach to constitutional law, that i hope blows Scalia's robes clear off and leaves him in his boxers.

    But when it comes to day-to-day practice of law, how do we, the practitioners, even add a modicum of Integral understanding to our duties?

    So, counsellors, how about coming up with your thoughts on this?

    Lynne D. Feldman, Esq.

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  •  07-05-2006, 12:44 PM 964 in reply to 831

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I have a simple question---how does one start a new thread?

     

    later,

    gene

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  •  07-05-2006, 9:33 PM 996 in reply to 964

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I just added it on the first page with New Topic.
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  •  07-06-2006, 9:19 AM 1021 in reply to 831

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    Awesome.  I don't have much time now, but I'm an attorney in Big Law in Chicago.  I was sorely disappointed when, after annoucing repeatedly that a center for Integral Law was going to be started with IU, IU's homepage showed up with Integral Criminal Law.  So, it's very cool to have this thread to delve into.

    I know of many different paths that people have started down with an intent to alter the way the game is played or how it occurs to the players, including collaborative law, mediation, and general people training for lawyers.  I will also mention again that general training in relating to people in particular ways can make a huge difference.  For example, if even 10% of attorneys in a given practice and geographic area had completed the Landmark Forum, the experience of practicing law would be different because the communication available would be different, the culture would begin to alter, and people would be able to be collaborative even while maintaining the adversarial tension.  Programs and trainings like this one would make a difference generally. 

    So those are my off the cuff thoughts.


    One does not discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the shore for a very long time. --Andre Gide

    Hope is as hollow as fear. --Lao-tzu
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  •  07-06-2006, 8:03 PM 1070 in reply to 1021

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I totally agree with you.  I'm in a hurry right now as well----hey, aren't all lawyers always in a hurry??

    When I have some time, I'd like to share how I sat juries and did openings and closings that helped me win many times, all using Ken's model, altho he didn't call it AQAL at the time.  I also want to weigh in on ADR and see if anyone finds it useful.  I did divorce mediation in NJ but it never really worked well.  Then I would like to tackle an issue that several of us hassled over---does becoming 2nd tier mean that you can't stand practicing law?????

    Lynne

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  •  07-07-2006, 11:01 AM 1094 in reply to 1070

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I would love to hear how you integrated that functionally.  I actually do pro bono mediation with unrepresented parties, so it would also be interesting to discuss how to approach ADR integrally.  As for your last issue, I'm excited and curious to hear your thoughts (I guess at this point it would be to read your thoughts, but only on paper -- although for some of this, it might be interesting to gather a small group of interested parties together for a conference call to discuss some of these issues offline). 
    One does not discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the shore for a very long time. --Andre Gide

    Hope is as hollow as fear. --Lao-tzu
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  •  07-12-2006, 3:44 PM 1347 in reply to 1094

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I hope you've just gotten busy, like I have.  I really want to pursue this line of conversation.
    One does not discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the shore for a very long time. --Andre Gide

    Hope is as hollow as fear. --Lao-tzu
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  •  07-13-2006, 12:02 PM 1384 in reply to 1347

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    i wrote two massive notes and tried to post them here.  the freaking website software loses text likely because i got timed out and had to sign in again.  who's brilliant idea was that time out thing?

    i'll try to regather my wits and rejoin here at some later point in history.

     

    later,

    gene

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  •  07-13-2006, 12:42 PM 1387 in reply to 1384

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I have a practice, learned from the forum over at IN, of always copying my post before posting it, just in case.  I suggest you do the same, until that issue gets resolved, if ever.
    One does not discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the shore for a very long time. --Andre Gide

    Hope is as hollow as fear. --Lao-tzu
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  •  07-14-2006, 2:06 PM 1437 in reply to 1384

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    Yuk, Gene, did you report it?  If not, need me to do it for you??

    Just got back from a retreat with 7 Integral educators who are helping me with the I Ed Center.  Got me thinking about I Law, and how a small group of lawyers, on a concall as you (not Gene) said, then we need to follow up with space on this forum for private brainstorming.  That's how I Ed developed.  So---when do you want to do a concall, and I can set it up thru II???  I am free anytime until July 23rd when I fly off to ILP 2, then will be back mid-August again.

    Dates, gentlemen??

    Lynne the Lawyer 

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  •  07-17-2006, 9:19 AM 1518 in reply to 1437

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    I have time Wednesday evening after 7 central time or Satruday after 11 am central. 
    One does not discover new lands without consenting to lose sight of the shore for a very long time. --Andre Gide

    Hope is as hollow as fear. --Lao-tzu
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  •  07-17-2006, 8:09 PM 1544 in reply to 1518

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    Sounds good to me.  Gene?  There is also another attorney who has written a paper for the AQAL Journal who I have spoken with, and I'll reach out to him as well.  Then we'll get a concall line from II set up.

    Any others legally inclined listening in out there???

    Lynne

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  •  08-26-2006, 7:59 AM 5428 in reply to 1544

    • tallen is not online. Last active: 05-05-2007, 6:56 AM tallen
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    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    Lynne and others,

    I am an attorney as well, currently with Chevron.  I'm also in my third year of a master's at Naropa in Transpersonal Counseling Psychology and interning at Boulder Mediation Services which will suggest to you my lack of satisfaction with the law in its present form.  My idealist self actually believes that law should be unnecessary in the world of humans, but my realist self knows we're not there yet.  I wonder if U.S. law is fundamentally broken, as it began from a property culture imposed on a non-property one and from a revolutionary group trying to create a social order that would protect its freedoms against those who would quell the revolution. 

    Law, as it is practiced today, has become part of the power and process that defends and reinforces that socially ordered, property culture.  So the question of how to improve the practice of law as it is currently feels to me like a question that, at its core, accepts and incorporates a system and culture that will need to change fundamentally if we are to survive as a species.  

    Regardless, as is true of any desired social change including how law is practiced, I believe the changes must begin with ourselves and our own internal beliefs.  Those internal changes will change how we behave externally and what we perceive to be possible in the social and cultural realms, including our profession.  In other words, integrating and modeling the best of what humans can be is always where I believe the work starts.

    Those are my initial thoughts.  I look forward to learning more about how to change what is in law so our legal practice can align with the leadings of our souls.

    All my best,

    Tracy Allen


    Tracy Allen
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  •  08-26-2006, 12:14 PM 5471 in reply to 5428

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    what is needed, imo, for an integral law center to be established is a series of  live collaboration sessions of all integrally informed interested parties who will dedicate time to move it forward (including travel time), not necessarily just lawyers.

    i envision a conference where an ILP is mixed in with legal brainstorming.

    later,

    gene

     

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  •  10-09-2006, 11:41 AM 10604 in reply to 5471

    • cgnost is not online. Last active: 06-08-2008, 6:35 PM cgnost
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    • Points 425

    Re: INTEGRAL LAW

    hi all - i'm recenty out of law school and would love to be involved in any ongoing efforts on these points.  sounds like there's lots of seeds of ideas that could take lots of forms - advocacy, academic scholarship, practical guidance, etc.

    also, i recently had a student note published in the Michigan Law Review on a developmental look at some areas of constitutional law, would love to have any/all of you read it and offer feedback: http://ssrn.com/abstract=930865

    thanks
    chris

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