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What's Going On Here?

Last post 12-28-2006, 6:41 PM by pattye. 4 replies.
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  •  12-01-2006, 11:01 PM 15753

    What's Going On Here?

    Check out the following video of a Pentecostal gathering, in which laughter pushes peope into apparent trance states.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjujnAs-6tM

    The video clip is obviously produced by people who think these Pentecostals are nuts.  And they might be!  But I'm interested in hearing an Integrally informed response to this.  How would you describe it?  What's going on, in your opinion?

     


    May the boundless knowledge that time presents and space allows illuminate the native perspectives of your original face.

  •  12-03-2006, 7:10 AM 15789 in reply to 15753

    Re: What's Going On Here?

    Hi Balder,

     

    This morning, i noted that many folks are viewing this Youtube video.  As of yet, there's been no response from forum members.  But being short on opinions is not something i've ever been accused of; so here's my take on what's happening in it.

     

    Obviously, these folks have entered an altered state, something that can happen at any stage of consciousness. The key to their entering this state is laughter. And laughter has a reputation for being contagious, as can be seen in this article from Psychology Today, linked here:

    http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/PTO-20001101-000036.html

     

    Perhaps part of the energy being released comes from a sense of communion; this should come as no surprise in any sort of Christian meeting. Jesus is reported to have said, “Where two or more are gathered in my name, I will be there also.” This saying, coupled with the experience of certain esoteric Christians has engendered a point of view that equates what is known as ‘Christ Consciousness’ with group consciousness; so at its best, this sort of Pentecostal scene could be described as part of the Return, where Jesus does not return as an individual but collectively -in group phenomenon.

     

    Here are comments on two features depicted in the video; first is about release.  There was a great deal of release going on here, and the question raised in my mind is from what? What greater uptightness could there be than that of original sin? A notion so pernicious that people are condemned not by what they have done, but by the fact of their being! This is an idea that flies in the face of any sense of justice and is in complete opposition to the notion of Buddha Nature, or as i like to call it “essential dignity” –the birthright of every human. So my guess is that this release is tied to that confining negating notion, it is also tied to a temporary but partial release from the constraints of the contracted self. And this leads me to my second point; notice at the end of the video that the laughing slipped into a cooing, lamenting, almost crying state. Somehow deeply buried in this shift is a hint, that despite their laughter they have missed the mark.

     

    Elsewhere i have outlined in broad strokes a scheme of stage development. It goes something like this: humans collectively and individually evolve according to a certain pattern.  First is the physical body with its energies, then the emotional body with its energies, then the mental body with its energies, the intuitive body with its energies, and the more subtle body sometimes called the truth body, or spirit body, with its energies, and so on. By this schema these Pentecostal folks are pretty much stuck at the emotional stage, but can and do experience the energies of that stage.

     

    It appears they would have to do a whole lot of transcending and including, in order to allow for a more full realization.

     

    Warmly,

     

    Charles

    88W18'28" 41N58'02"

     

     

     

     

     

     

  •  12-27-2006, 9:39 PM 17280 in reply to 15789

    Re: What's Going On Here?

    There are laughathons going on in different places and have been reported in the news.  In this case, it seems much more pleasant than shouting about the end coming. When I used to see those signs on trees while traveling in the south, I would think that life must be so miserable for some people that they comforted themselves in that way. 

    Men in suits (nice suits) seemed to be the ones on the floor and "needing" the closeness of touch and letting it all hang out.  It might be a good thing for Jerry

    Falwell to try.   There is a game called "Ha Ha".  One person lays on the floor and the next lays their head on first person's stomach.  Then the third lays head on second person's stomach.  YOu can wind all around a room.  First person says "Ha"

    Second says Ha Ha and third says Ha Ha Ha and on down the line. By the third person the laughter escalates and it is fun esp when children are in the mix.  Just silly

    fun.   It made me feel good to see them giving it a try.  Maybe it is the beginning of adding a little bit of Integral.  Some were making faces and being goofy like the body work class that is on video led by Sophia.   I was smiling the whole time

    I was watching it.     It would be a nice way to think of Jesus returning that way for

    their point of view.  I found Charles comments - esp. the "essential dignity" that is the birthright of every human. And -  "it is also tied to a temporary but partial release from the constraints of the contracted self.    I could almost feel relief as they changed patterns from the "script".    Nice.   Pattye

  •  12-28-2006, 10:13 AM 17288 in reply to 15753

    Re: What's Going On Here?

    This reminds me of Shaktipat that some Hindu Guru's are able to deliver to their disciples.  This was true for my past guru, Amrit Desai.  I was particularly struck by the audience's powerful reaction when the pastor made a strong gesture with his arm in their direction.  I suspect that in that moment he was "throwing" shaktipat energy at them and they reacted as they would if that were the case.  My experience with shaktipat energy is that it is totally blissful, tingly, heart opening, joyess, tender.  It seems that there is a laughter component that this guy uses which I'm not familiar with, but energetically, while I was watching the video, I thought and felt something sacred was going on, despite how bizarre it appeared.  I've seen and heard people barking like dogs after receiving shaktipat, so on some level, I wasn't surprised by what I was witnessing.  I don't have any western or scientific explanation for the video or the phenomenon, but I do believe it was an authentically spiritual phenomenon caught on tape.  Too bad it's being dismissed and trivialized.
    There are two types of conversations worth having; those about the deepest things, and gossip!
  •  12-28-2006, 6:41 PM 17311 in reply to 17288

    Re: What's Going On Here?

    Dear Kameshvar:  Yes.  Thank you for more kindness. It is nice to feel this way.

    Pattye

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